Best Of 2010 - The preamble

[Black Amnesia of Heaven]

"Fifteen" isn't feminist either.  It's presenting youthful relationships in a more realistic light - while it's certainly a proper and positive presentation, there's nothing that would undermine anti-feminist narratives.  Telling girls to be a bit more careful before they believe that someone is Prince Charming is, again, entirely different than discarding the notion.

Also, don't most of her songs sort of exalt the impulse that "Fifteen" rejects?

I think I said "approaching feminism." Taylor Swift isn't Bikini Kill. I'm just saying she isn't "antifeminist."

[Antero]

Also: Lots of artists trade exclusively in love songs and meet the same criticism. 

who

Most pop artists in the last fifty years?

Love crops up quite a lot as something to sing about, cos most groups make most of their songs about falling in love or how happy they are to be in love, you occasionally wonder why these groups do sing about it all the time - it's because these groups think there's something very special about it.  Either that or else it's because everybody else sings about it and always has, you know to burst into song you have to be inspired and nothing inspires quite like love.

These groups and singers think that they appeal to everyone by singing about love because apparently everyone has or can love, or so they would have you believe anyway, but these groups seem to go along with what, the belief that love is deep in everyone's personality. I don't think we're saying there's anything wrong with love, we just don't think that what goes on between two people should be shrouded with mystery.

[Black Amnesia of Heaven]

Man, I don't know, that just doesn't scream with the same fervor that practically every anti-Taylor Swift diatribe I've read does. Not enough "[artist] is a child" or "all [artist] sings about is dudes."

I will concede that punk rock groups from the '70s probably weren't into mainstream depictions of love.

[Black Amnesia of Heaven]

Also, don't most of her songs sort of exalt the impulse that "Fifteen" rejects?

Also it should be said that this is why I find her interesting. I realize other people will find her reprehensible for it.

[Antero]

I'm sure, had I the patience, I could cross-reference a wide variety of articles denouncing various pop artists to demonstrate that the vitriol directed at Taylor Swift is hardly unique, but I have some paint to watch dry feel me?  She's not unique.

[edit] And yeah, I find that... at best, hypocritical in a weirdly condescending way. 

[Black Amnesia of Heaven]

Yeah I had an argument in blog form with one of my friends over that very thing. He found her morally reprehensible. And I was like, "Oh, but that's why I return to her work, because there's this whole tension occurring."

Also I am ridiculously emotionally invested in her music so there's that.

[Antero]

Why are you quite so invested in it?

[Black Amnesia of Heaven]

I don't know, man, she sort of signified a whole lot of new things opening up for me in terms of music I could align with. I liked "You Belong with Me" for its incredible uplift, but man, did I ever hate "Love Story" for a lot of reasons, most of which collected in the lyrics. Out of curiosity, I listened to Fearless, and I was sort of endeared by the first line, where Swift, before the dude even enters the frame, sings this:

There's somethin' 'bout the way the street looks when it's just rained
There's a glow off the pavement

And I'm like, "Oh, that's nice, I see what people were talking about re: her lyrics." Then when I realized "White Horse" was the undoing of "Love Story" and that she had actually strung up a narrative across two songs (which isn't impressive or special but regardless registered as neat to me) I sort of gave in entirely. I also just really like the music. It is bright and electric and overproduced and sort of gets all my circuits running.

EDIT: I should also add that I like a lot of overwrought overproduced pop rock (say, like the last Fall Out Boy record) and this hits the same notes. I am really into easy melodic turns that are also by all means emotionally manipulative. Metal has a similar effect on me, with entirely different aesthetics. I like the giving in.

[Andrew_TSKS]

I gotta say, I think Anne's point about Taylor Swift encouraging the perception of her as a teenager rather than an adult, even despite the fact that she's basically the same age as other pop singers who are regarded unequivocally as adults, is a legitimate one. If it weren't 3:30 AM I'd produce a list of comparable artists who engage as adults but are the same age as Swift, but as it is I'm tired so that will have to wait. But my point is that I don't think that criticism is easily dismissed. Some of the others, maybe, but that one has validity.

[alistarr*]

wait, people aren't allowed to choose their personality any more? or did i miss the part where you guys all hung out with taylor swift after a show one night and she was saying rude words and arranging arms deals over the phone until just before dawn?

oh, or are we just saying "act your age not your shoe size" and it's time i stopped watching cartoons?

[Anne the Man]

I think choosing a personality of giggly self-absorption has its flaws, yes. It's not a choice between acting 'good' or 'bad', it's between being childish and mature. The ones who act 'bad' are no more mature, necessarily, but at least they don't act like they need massive amounts of slack cut them cos they're 'just a kid'.

Full disclosure: I borrowed/stole a lot of these points from this thing that Maaik linked on Facepalm awhile ago.

[Black Amnesia of Heaven]

Yeah and I think that that autostraddle article is basically the worst written thing on the internet, and I already responded to it at length here: http://unbornwhiskey.tumblr.com/post/382818592/tiger-beatdown-tales-of-vindication-taylor-swift

[Ignatius]

You guys are all aware that you are dwarfed as a potential audience for Taylor Swift by actual teenage girls, right?

[Black Amnesia of Heaven]

Sure. What does that have to do with the conversation?

[ellaguru]

Okay, I am now listening to These New Puritans - Hidden, on the strength of the Pitchfork review of "We Want War" (#100 on their best tracks list). It is really good. Lots of interesting percussion. I'll probably have to make some space for it on my list. Check out the song, though, so far most of the stuff on the album has been pretty similar.

[davy]

I've been seeing The Radio Dept. pop up on a lot of lists lately, and I've given the lead single from their album, "Heaven's on Fire" a few listens. It gets better every time. Are there any Radio Dept fans around here?

Ellaguru, I've earmarked that singles list at pfork for my work listening tonight, so I'll get around to that New Puritans song this evening.

[edison]

Okay, I am now listening to These New Puritans - Hidden, on the strength of the Pitchfork review of "We Want War" (#100 on their best tracks list). It is really good. Lots of interesting percussion. I'll probably have to make some space for it on my list. Check out the song, though, so far most of the stuff on the album has been pretty similar.

Apparently (not that I could understand a word of it during the show) one of the Fall's newest songs is about These New Puritans, describing Smith watching "Danish cable TV" and taking "very much offence" at that band ripping off The Fall. One verse goes : "Adding to the nuisance value/It cost me £1.50/To call from Birmingham/To tell them what I thought of them/And that they did a plagiarism".

Still, I'm curious about that band too!

[nonotyet]

I've been seeing The Radio Dept. pop up on a lot of lists lately, and I've given the lead single from their album, "Heaven's on Fire" a few listens. It gets better every time. Are there any Radio Dept fans around here?

YES

[elpollodiablo]

I listened to that on the train a few times. It was okay. Kind of inoffensive, precious indie pop if I remember right.

[Antero]

You guys are all aware that you are dwarfed as a potential audience for Taylor Swift by actual teenage girls, right?

I, for one, don't think the problem with Taylor Swift is that she sings about being a teenager, or even that her account of high school is largely fabricated.  I mean, she's just barely 21, and when that awful "You Belong with Me" song came out she was 18.  That's... that's still teenage.  It's not like she's pushing thirty or something.  I think the other, anti-feminist elements are much more of a problem than her trying to present a teenage persona when she's essentially one herself.

[alex]

Okay, I am now listening to These New Puritans - Hidden, on the strength of the Pitchfork review of "We Want War" (#100 on their best tracks list). It is really good. Lots of interesting percussion. I'll probably have to make some space for it on my list. Check out the song, though, so far most of the stuff on the album has been pretty similar.

Apparently (not that I could understand a word of it during the show) one of the Fall's newest songs is about These New Puritans, describing Smith watching "Danish cable TV" and taking "very much offence" at that band ripping off The Fall. One verse goes : "Adding to the nuisance value/It cost me £1.50/To call from Birmingham/To tell them what I thought of them/And that they did a plagiarism".

Still, I'm curious about that band too!

I guess I'm starting to understand why some people above think that Taylor Swift is a good lyricist.

[davy]

I'm also getting kind of interested in this new Agalloch record. It's on EVERY LIST I'VE SEEN.

[ellaguru]

I think the Agalloch is really good. Part of me worries that it's metal for people who don't like metal, but then I remember that's me! and I go back to enjoying it.

[davy]

I think the Agalloch is really good. Part of me worries that it's metal for people who don't like metal, but then I remember that's me! and I go back to enjoying it.

Haha, exactly.

[jm]

Yeah that sentence really made my day